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Harley Davidson Forums - Model Discussions and Technical Discussions @ HDBitchin => Sportster Models Forum => Topic started by: Brent526 on October 29, 2017, 08:41:18 PM

Title: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on October 29, 2017, 08:41:18 PM
Need some help with this one. 2013 1200 with a lehman trike kit. Warm it up shut off check oil level is good. Ride about 100 miles everytime we come to a stop the oil light comes on. Give a little throttle goes off until RPMs drop comes back on. Running syn 3. Any help apprciated
Thank you

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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on October 29, 2017, 09:17:02 PM
You could have a bad oil pressure sender. In order to know if you truly have a real low pressure or just a bad sender is you would need to check the oil pressure with a master gauge.

Oil pressure issues can be a result of bad oil pump alignment, misplaced o-ring in the oil pump or a bad lifter/tappets.

Take a look at this thread for some more details for an issue like you are experiencing.

Lubrication (Oiling) Issues 
https://hdbitchin.com/index.php/topic,2829.0.html
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: WantMore on October 30, 2017, 09:32:05 AM
This video is a Twin Cam motor but it will give you the basics of checking the pressure with a master gauge.

https://youtu.be/jmz12jw6W9Y

Something cheap that can be done easily is a R&R the oil filter. Replace the oil filter and see if that helps. Maybe the filter is restricting the oil flow/pressure. After removing the filter cut it open with a hacksaw and see if you have any trapped debris in that filter.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on October 30, 2017, 09:53:40 AM
Now that WantMore has mentioned the oil filter it made me think. Make sure you are using a filter for a Evolution motor which is what your 1200 motor is. The EVO style motor does not use an oil filter with a “drain-back” valve and the micron value is less restrictive. Follow this link to some information on the differences between a Twin Cam oil filter and an Evolution oil filter.

https://hdbitchin.com/index.php/topic,3088.msg28986.html#msg28986

Using a Twin Cam style oil filter would likely cause a lower pressure since it filters down to 5 microns and the EVO is a 30 micron oil filter design. 
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on October 30, 2017, 09:47:21 PM
This video is a Twin Cam motor but it will give you the basics of checking the pressure with a master gauge.

https://youtu.be/jmz12jw6W9Y

Something cheap that can be done easily is a R&R the oil filter. Replace the oil filter and see if that helps. Maybe the filter is restricting the oil flow/pressure. After removing the filter cut it open with a hacksaw and see if you have any trapped debris in that filter.
I will look at the filter. Oil was recently changed at a dealership.

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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on October 30, 2017, 09:52:45 PM
This video is a Twin Cam motor but it will give you the basics of checking the pressure with a master gauge.

https://youtu.be/jmz12jw6W9Y

Something cheap that can be done easily is a R&R the oil filter. Replace the oil filter and see if that helps. Maybe the filter is restricting the oil flow/pressure. After removing the filter cut it open with a hacksaw and see if you have any trapped debris in that filter.
If the pressure sensor isnt an arm and leg just replacing it might be a good follow up to checking for correct filter.


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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on October 31, 2017, 07:00:49 AM
If the pressure sensor isnt an arm and leg just replacing it might be a good follow up to checking for correct filter.


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Let us know what you find.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: WantMore on November 04, 2017, 09:50:42 AM
Any good news @Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175)
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on November 04, 2017, 10:37:17 AM
Replaced oil filter. put a few miles on it all looks good so far. She's going to ride down to the Rocky Point Rally next week. Will be a good test.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on November 04, 2017, 10:53:20 AM
Replaced oil filter. put a few miles on it all looks good so far. She's going to ride down to the Rocky Point Rally next week. Will be a good test.
Was it the correct oil filter for the Sportster engine? Or maybe did you cut it open and find debris collected inside?
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: NoSuperSlabs on November 15, 2017, 06:30:34 PM
Any news @Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175) ?

Was the removed filter the Correct filter for your Sportster Evolution motor?

Debris in the old filter?
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on November 15, 2017, 09:16:30 PM


Any news @Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175) ?

Was the removed filter the Correct filter for your Sportster Evolution motor?

Debris in the old filter?

I didnt think to keep the filter and cut it open. Once we had gone a good hundred miles bike warm  the oil light again came on when at idle. Increase RPM oil light goes out until RPMs are dropped. I will change out the pressure switch next week


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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: NoSuperSlabs on November 18, 2017, 08:00:00 AM
Thanks for your update.

It wasn’t mentioned but it could be low oil level. Being that you are a trike your motor sits straight up. Most oil check instructions will have you check the oil level while sitting on the side stand. The level seen on the dipstick could rise with the bike siting straight up versus leaned over on the jiffy stand. That could mean you are slightly low on oil volume.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on November 18, 2017, 12:24:15 PM
Thanks for your update.

It wasn’t mentioned but it could be low oil level. Being that you are a trike your motor sits straight up. Most oil check instructions will have you check the oil level while sitting on the side stand. The level seen on the dipstick could rise with the bike siting straight up versus leaned over on the jiffy stand. That could mean you are slightly low on oil volume.
I like your thinking NoSuperSlabs.

@Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175) if you know someone with a similar year Sportster that isn’t modified to a trike you might want to ask them to check their oil level hot while sitting on the jiffy stand and if at the proper hot level then hold their motorcycle straight up and then check the oil level on the dipstick while straight up. That should show you where your trike’s oil level should be at.

After checking with this other person’s Sportster the question would then be, does your hot check compare to that person’s straight up level?

I don’t think there would be a significant difference in the level but maybe it is enough to cause your issue.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on November 18, 2017, 06:25:58 PM
Thanks for your update.

It wasn’t mentioned but it could be low oil level. Being that you are a trike your motor sits straight up. Most oil check instructions will have you check the oil level while sitting on the side stand. The level seen on the dipstick could rise with the bike siting straight up versus leaned over on the jiffy stand. That could mean you are slightly low on oil volume.
I had that thought as well.


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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on November 18, 2017, 06:27:02 PM
I like your thinking NoSuperSlabs.

@Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175) if you know someone with a similar year Sportster that isn’t modified to a trike you might want to ask them to check their oil level hot while sitting on the jiffy stand and if at the proper hot level then hold their motorcycle straight up and then check the oil level on the dipstick while straight up. That should show you where your trike’s oil level should be at.

After checking with this other person’s Sportster the question would then be, does your hot check compare to that person’s straight up level?

I don’t think there would be a significant difference in the level but maybe it is enough to cause your issue.
Great idea now to find one to compare

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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: maniacmac on November 19, 2017, 09:42:05 AM
I believe you are just thowing stuff at the problem and have not determined if you have low oil pressure. Check it with a master gauge. If it's not low, then the oil pressure sending unit is at fault. If it is low it may be several things and all are internal problems except the oil reg. valve. Because your problem occur at temp it sounds like worn pump or reg. valve. Or the oil ring Tank mentioned earlier. The oil sending unit is before the filter and would not be affected by a filter plus there a by pass for plugged filters.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: maniacmac on December 11, 2017, 09:47:11 AM
I believe you are just thowing stuff at the problem and have not determined if you have low oil pressure. Check it with a master gauge. If it's not low, then the oil pressure sending unit is at fault. If it is low it may be several things and all are internal problems except the oil reg. valve. Because your problem occur at temp it sounds like worn pump or reg. valve. Or the oil ring Tank mentioned earlier. The oil sending unit is before the filter and would not be affected by a filter plus there a by pass for plugged filters.
   I hope I didn't offend anyone by being so blunt but I was trying to get him on the right track.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on December 11, 2017, 10:21:30 AM
   I hope I didn't offend anyone by being so blunt but I was trying to get him on the right track.
I don’t think anyone would have took that input as anything but words of experience.  :)
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: AbueloBill on December 11, 2017, 12:22:54 PM

@Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175) if you know someone with a similar year Sportster that isn’t modified to a trike you might want to ask them to check their oil level hot while sitting on the jiffy stand and if at the proper hot level then hold their motorcycle straight up and then check the oil level on the dipstick while straight up. That should show you where your trike’s oil level should be at.

After checking with this other person’s Sportster the question would then be, does your hot check compare to that person’s straight up level?

I don’t think there would be a significant difference in the level but maybe it is enough to cause your issue.

I have a 2016 Sportster Custom and have had extensive conversations with the service department over several oil issues (long story for another time).  What they have told me may be of assistance.

1. Oil level is to be checked hot and with the bike on the jiffy stand, and as soon after shutting the engine off as reasonable.  The level should be between the half and three-quarters mark, slightly lower is OK but not higher. 

If the oil is too high you would run the risk of it blowing back from the heads into the air cleaner.  The oil/vapor is then sucked into the intake and then into the combustion chambers, if too much the filter gets overwhelmed plus the unburned oil can build up in the cylinder.  If the oil level is too low you can simply add oil.  If not checked promptly the oil can sump back into the case and thus give a false reading.
 
2.  The Service Manual shows the following.  This applies to all XL models and the pressure reading is taken at the oil pressure switch fitting.

Table 3-16.  Oil Pressure:  At Operating Temperature

1000 RPM  7-12 PSI   43.3-82.7 kPa

2500 RPM  12-17 PSI  68.9-117  kPa
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: AbueloBill on February 02, 2018, 08:44:29 AM
Need some help with this one. 2013 1200 with a lehman trike kit. Warm it up shut off check oil level is good. Ride about 100 miles everytime we come to a stop the oil light comes on. Give a little throttle goes off until RPMs drop comes back on. Running syn 3. Any help apprciated
Thank you

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Brent, did you ever find out what the problem was, and how did you finally resolve it?
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on August 04, 2018, 09:32:44 AM
Brent, did you ever find out what the problem was, and how did you finally resolve it?
@Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175) did you solve this?
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on August 06, 2018, 04:55:26 PM
Nope I had heart surgery and haven't been able to monkey with it.



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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: J F Go on August 06, 2018, 05:34:40 PM
Nope I had heart surgery and haven't been able to monkey with it.



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Sorry to hear that @Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175). Sure hope you get back to doing the thing you love soon. Will be keeping you in my prayers for a full and speedy recovery. Get well soon. :)
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on August 06, 2018, 05:36:39 PM
Sorry to hear that @Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175). Sure hope you get back to doing the thing you love soon. Will be keeping you in my prayers for a full and speedy recovery. Get well soon. :)
@Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175)
Same sentiment here! Get well soon!
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: NoSuperSlabs on August 07, 2018, 10:37:39 AM
Nope I had heart surgery and haven't been able to monkey with it.



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Get well soon!
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on August 12, 2018, 10:34:24 AM
I looked in a 2010 Sportster manual and it doesn't say anything about checking the oil when the bike is level. It only covers the check that would be performed when the motorcycle is leaning over on the Jiffy stand.

In a Touring manual they show the dipstick level check for a motorcycle leaning over on a Jiffy stand and also the dipstick oil mark that would be done with a bike in the upright position which they call the "sidecar use". The Touring motorcycles have dipsticks that have two different sets of marking on the dipstick, one for Jiffy stand and one for sidecar use.

Here are the two side views of a Touring motorcycle dipstick.

Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on August 12, 2018, 08:46:54 PM
Thanks for positive wishes. Appreciate them.


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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: bc45 on August 12, 2018, 08:48:29 PM
@Brent526 (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5175)  hope you have a fast full recovery
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on July 06, 2019, 08:10:50 AM
Changed the pressure sensor , road test , not resolved. Took to dealership I know mechanic. He went through the engine couldn't find anything. Wants to try straight weight oil next oil change. Again the oil light comes on at idle after 75-100 miles in the Arizona heat

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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: NoSuperSlabs on July 06, 2019, 08:35:25 AM
So I would assume that the oil pressure sensor was changed because you measured proper pressure on a master gauge? That proves that when you measured the pressure it was in spec at that moment but might be dropping out of spec after 100 miles. That fact that it is dropping out of spec after 100 miles might be pointing to a bad oil pump that drops the pressure after the period of time that it takes to run 100 miles.
Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: Brent526 on July 06, 2019, 08:51:54 AM
So I would assume that the oil pressure sensor was changed because you measured proper pressure on a master gauge? That proves that when you measured the pressure it was in spec at that moment but might be dropping out of spec after 100 miles. That fact that it is dropping out of spec after 100 miles might be pointing to a bad oil pump that drops the pressure after the period of time that it takes to run 100 miles.
Any suggestions to pin point the oil pump as source of problem. Heading to idaho in a couple weeks trying to avoid failure bout in the midst of no where



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Title: Re: Oil light comes on after 100 miles
Post by: HDBitchin on July 06, 2019, 09:23:36 AM
Take a peak at the below linked thread...

Lubrication (Oiling) Issues  (https://hdbitchin.com/index.php?topic=2829.0)

In general you might consider these as potential causes...

Low Oil Pressure
1. Oil reservoir underfilled.
2. Faulty low oil pressure switch.
3. Oil pump O-ring damaged or missing.
4. Bypass valve stuck in open position.
5. Ball missing or leaking in cam support plate.
6. Worn oil pump gerotor(s).
7. Oil diluted with gasoline.

What is your idle RPMs?